User talk:Dystopos

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Use this page to make comments or ask questions of Bhamwiki's founder. For earlier discussions, check User talk:Dystopos/Archive01. For help in making sure I don't get a big head, go here.

Comments (sign with four tildes: ~~~~)

Getting started

  • I need some help getting started. I have a whole list of things I thought of. I do not see instructions anywhere for the syntax of adding articles. Do I just upload junk and it magically happens?? --MacroAlan 17:01, 03 May 2007 (CDT)
  • (copied from User talk:MacroAlan): I haven't taken the time to write much on how to get started on Bhamwiki. Basically, you're right. If you upload some junk it will magically get taken care of (by me or someone else). Wikipedia has a tutorial on basic editing here. I've posted a few notes (nothing close to comprehensive) on particularities of Bhamwiki style here. Perhaps the most expeditious way to get a feel for things is to "peek behind the curtain" on existing articles by clicking the "edit" tab. And I'll be happy to answer any specific questions you think up. --Dystopos 15:31, 3 May 2007 (PDT)

4th Avenue

  • Right on. I started that article once, but didn't take care to save intermittently (or to compose it in wordpad or something) and lost it to a power interruption. That kind of thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth. --Dystopos 16:48, 9 August 2010 (PDT)
    • Yeah, I hate losing work like that and also really hate redoing it. I was looking at the wanted pages list and 4th Avenue North was the highest ranked article that wasn't a year or a big event (e.g. World War II), so I thought I'd knock it out. --Lkseitz 10:43, 10 August 2010 (PDT)
      • I'm so glad to hear you're working on that WWII article, now! Here's a template (EofA) and a good read: (0817350276) --Dystopos 11:05, 10 August 2010 (PDT)
        • Nice try, but I wouldn't know to begin how to summarize World War II for Bhamwiki. I think 1978 is more of a scale that I could handle. --Lkseitz 11:19, 10 August 2010 (PDT)

RReach reverts

When you reverted Ray Reach's web site listings, you also removed several album covers he'd added previously (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6). Was that intentional? --Lkseitz 11:31, 26 January 2011 (PST)

  • No. Oops. --Dystopos 11:32, 26 January 2011 (PST)
    • Fixed 'em. --Lkseitz 15:14, 26 January 2011 (PST)

Walker Country

  • You had me hoping the typo was on the patch itself. --Dystopos 07:28, 8 March 2011 (PST)
    • I'll try to do better next time ;-). --Wheresdib 07:44, 8 March 2011 (PST)


I just wanted to make sure you saw my comments regarding inconsistencies in the years for John Holcomb, Jr and Bibb County. I don't know if you have answers, but you wrote the articles in question. --Lkseitz 07:24, 15 June 2011 (PDT)


Regarding the Sustainability box templates, I give up (again). It must be some sort of setting in MediaWiki to get it to ignore the fact the DIV tag in the footer is unmatched within the template. --Lkseitz 08:34, 6 July 2011 (PDT)

  • Ah, yes. Should have done this first. It's a change in MediaWiki starting with 1.12 that allows you to open a DIV in one template and close it in another. We're running 1.10, so it won't work, although apparently we could try it as a table. --Lkseitz 08:38, 6 July 2011 (PDT)


Did you get a new Alabama almanac or something? --Lkseitz 15:29, 26 February 2012 (PST)

1922 & 1924 Bham city directories

  • Supposedly online, but I'm not having success viewing them. (link) --Dystopos 05:16, 17 March 2012 (PDT)
    • The 1922 directory is a 1,370 page PDF file, 457 megabytes. And the first page is blank, making it non-obvious that it has successfully loaded until you scroll down. But the good news is that it's text searchable (mostly)! The bad news is too much information. For example, I doubt we want to list 39 separate businesses that had offices within the Lyric Theatre's office space. And that's just 1922! (Perhaps a separate page with a sortable table for Lyric Building tenants?) I'm now trying to load the 1924 one. --Lkseitz 09:09, 19 March 2012 (PDT)

Reference templates

The link you added to Bhamwiki:Templates in the References section is actually redundant with the link the header goes to. But now I'm concerned that the fact that the headers link to their categories may not be obvious enough. Thoughts? --Lkseitz 06:49, 8 June 2012 (PDT)

  • I guess it wasn't obvious enough for me. --Dystopos 07:01, 8 June 2012 (PDT)

19th Century

You've completed the 19th century. I've never completed anything. I think I even still have stub mayors. --Dystopos 17:53, 22 August 2012 (PDT)

  • But unlike other Bhamwiki articles, the years require no outside research (beyond the Wikipedia page for that year for context). That makes them easier to crank out. And you created a whole freakin' wiki! I believe that counts for something. --Lkseitz 07:32, 23 August 2012 (PDT)

Chalkville Mountain Road category

Please delete it. --Wheresdib 13:41, 26 December 2012 (PST)

  • So deleted. --Dystopos 14:53, 28 December 2012 (PST)

Category:19th Place South

Please delete Category:19th Place South. See its talk page for why (redundant). --Lkseitz 15:28, 22 January 2013 (PST)


  • If you have some time, I'd like to suggest an update to the Malzahn article, too. Now go get that crystal trophy. --Dystopos 07:04, 8 December 2013 (PST)
    • I figured I would update it after the BCS Championship ;) --Wheresdib 09:05, 8 December 2013 (PST)

User groups & BBS numbers

  • I ran across this today. If you're not the one who put it there, it may interest you. --Dystopos 08:56, 9 January 2014 (PST)
    • I don't remember if I provided that particular file, but I provided some of these. Mainly, I provided the impetus for someone else to dig up the complete set of files and provide them. But I appreciate you thinking of me when you saw it! Guess I should finish my web pages on the B'ham BBS scene. --Lkseitz 09:11, 9 January 2014 (PST)

Secret History

What is "The Secret History of Bhamwiki"? --Wheresdib 14:42, 28 March 2014 (PDT)

  • It's when the cold, hard "truth" has no value as part of a story. --Dystopos 14:47, 28 March 2014 (PDT)
    • Shhh! The first rule of "The Secret History of Bhamwiki" is one does not talk about "The Secret History of Bhamwiki" (except in HTML comments). --Lkseitz 06:50, 29 March 2014 (PDT)


What does "cowing" mean in the first sentence of List of racially-motivated bombings? --Wheresdib 14:44, 28 March 2014 (PDT)

  • "cow" (v.) cause (someone) to submit to one's wishes by intimidation. --Dystopos 14:47, 28 March 2014 (PDT)

All-name team

Oporto Avenue

I believe your latest change to Oporto Avenue has it confused with Oporto Road. As I added to the Oporto-Madrid Boulevard article, Oporto Road was apparently often mistakenly called Oporto Avenue. If Oporto Avenue were extended south, it would have to cross part of Ruffner Mountain, very close to the former quarries (according to the 1959 & 1970 7.5 Irondale quadrangles). Sadly, Oporto Avenue does not have its name listed on either quadrangle. I'm guessing Long's Electronics was located the same place that's listed as "Stereo Warehouse (1983)" on the Oporto-Madrid article. --Lkseitz (talk) 16:55, 6 January 2016 (PST)

  • You're probably right. "Avenue" is spelled out in all its six-letter glory in the Kaleidoscope ad I came across. I guess I need to dig out some maps. --Dystopos (talk) 17:04, 6 January 2016 (PST)
    • Darn it, I don't know where my previous research on this is (or if I even kept notes). But the 1957 B'ham map on this page shows Naples Ave. mislabeled (I believe) as Maples Ave. Then it shows both Naples and Oporto Aves. resuming south of Georgia Road. So I guess we're both right. Oporto Avenue did "extend" to Montclair Road (Bankhead Highway), but it was in two distinct sections, not continuous. It looks like the southern Oporto path is pretty close to the present one, so I guess it was, in fact, Oporto Avenue. Although somewhere during my previous research I also found it called Oporto Road. Anyway, it appears all those roads on the 1957 map south of Georgia Road except Oporto were consumed by development in the area. --Lkseitz (talk) 22:29, 6 January 2016 (PST)
    • And apparently I should read the notes I left myself over on Talk:Oporto-Madrid Boulevard about so many references to Oporto Avenue. I've figured out what happened now. Will detail on said Talk page. Who could have imagined what started as two parallel roads two blocks apart would wind up becoming known by a single name? --Lkseitz (talk) 12:08, 7 January 2016 (PST)

OK to upload larger version?

Would it be OK for me to upload a larger version of File:1972 Shepherd-Sloss Building.jpg? Earthsound (talk) 18:01, 23 March 2016 (PDT)

  • If you see the need. My [I assume that Darren's] thinking behind uploading at 1200 pixels was that we wouldn't display it in a browser any wider than that, and we're only using it by permission. Would it be just as well to make the link to the BPL's page more prominent? --Dystopos (talk) 06:41, 24 March 2016 (PDT)
    • In keeping with the desire to respect the permission to use, I uploaded a newer version (1200px width) that has a slightly tighter crop, better clarity, less crushed blacks, and fixes the weird darkened right side from the original better than the existing version. Btw, I added some info on the talk page of the Talk:Piggly Wiggly. Earthsound (talk) 18:15, 24 March 2016 (PDT)
      • There's no telling what I was thinking originally! Anything to make it better, I'm all for. --Wheresdib (talk) 11:59, 25 March 2016 (PDT)

Homestead Village

If you would like to grab the images for the shopping center off this article, feel free to do so. I can't get them to work right so they look decent on our page. --Wheresdib (talk) 11:59, 25 March 2016 (PDT)

renaming pages

What is the preferred method for renaming a page? I created a page named Complete health, but didn't realize until it was already created that the 'H' in 'health' needs to be capitalized. Robert Matthews (talk) 19:58, 3 September 2016 (PDT)

Mobile App

Is there a mobile app available for this wiki? I downloaded one a while back for Wikipedia and wondered if you had anything similar? Robert Matthews (talk) 07:19, 16 November 2016 (PST)

  • I use Safari, but otherwise, no. No app and no clear path toward one. --Dystopos (talk) 07:45, 16 November 2016 (PST)
    • I have some experience developing iOS apps, so it might be fairly easy to modify the open-source code available for the Wikipedia app and change the database to point to the BhamWiki. I've downloaded the code, but haven't taken the time to load it and see exactly what changes would be required. Would this be of interest? Robert Matthews (talk) 10:08, 16 November 2016 (PST)
      • It would certainly be of interest, if it's not too complicated to accomplish. I have no expertise on server stuff, so maybe we should plan to sit down over coffee some time and discuss what it would entail. --Dystopos (talk) 10:15, 16 November 2016 (PST)
  • Continued at Bhamwiki talk:Messageboard

Invasive vs Non-native

Invasive vs Non-native

I changed your new "invasive" categories to "non-native" for two reasons. First, "invasive" is a subset of non-native, which can include intentional or incidental introductions which do not spread uncontrollably or crowd out native species; and second because the determination of whether something is invasive is a bit of a judgment call and I don't know whose authority we would use to back up our categorization. --Dystopos (talk) 06:26, 20 November 2017 (PST)

  • Okay, that's fine. I wasn't sure "invasive" was the best term to use, but decided to "be bold" and just do it. Yours also has the advantage of being sorted closely together. --Lkseitz (talk) 05:05, 21 November 2017 (PST)

Adding photo images

I'd like to add 3 or 4 images of the bronze sculpture of Parker to the page named "A. H. Parker statue". I took the photos myself after I installed it in 2013. Am I correct in assuming that I can't credit myself as the sculptor? Also, I have a flickr page - with my own name at the top of it - that includes "process" photos of the sculpture when it was clay. Is adding a link to that page allowed? Please advise.Brian R Owens (talk) 09:50, 5 May 2018 (PDT)

  • Yes, you can credit yourself and link to your page. --Dystopos (talk) 11:16, 5 May 2018 (PDT)

Primary v Secondary Sources

  • You removed all of the primary sources and accompanying information from the page 2021 Birmingham municipal elections with the comment Would prefer to summarize others' research. One of the reasons I began contributing to BhamWiki is because I am a professional researcher and I have been unhappy with the lack of accessible information and failure to cite primary sources cited in news articles. What is the justification for preferring to use secondary sources over primary sources, especially when no secondary sources exist? --BootstrapsRiley (talk) 08:38, 15 November 2020 (PST)
    • The justification is that as publisher I don't have the resources to edit original research and place it into context. I'm open to using primary sources when unavoidable and uncontroversial (See Bhamwiki:Policy). A political campaign doesn't really fit those criteria as it is likely to be covered widely by the press (as we get closer to August), and is certain to involve controversy. That said, it would satisfy my concerns if we could cite research and analysis that you have published independently. --Dystopos (talk) 09:20, 15 November 2020 (PST)

Song question

Did you see my question about "Birmingham Bus Station" on Talk:List of songs about Birmingham a couple months ago? --Lkseitz (talk) 04:26, 10 June 2021 (PDT)

  • Missed it. Sorry --Dystopos (talk) 04:51, 10 June 2021 (PDT)


Thanks for tackling that MSA/CSA stuff. I took one look and backed away slowly. --Dystopos (talk) 07:03, 16 June 2021 (PDT)

  • No problem. Sorry I didn't realize the changes sooner. I noted that we need a new graphic. Might I suggest a single graphic highlighting the six counties of the Birmingham-Hoover MSA in one color and the Cullman, Jasper, and Talladega-Sylacauga MicroSAs each in different colors. Then we can use one graphic for all the articles and just note the color(s) for the current article in the caption. --Lkseitz (talk) 21:19, 16 June 2021 (PDT)

Worlds Games venues

  • Hello! Been a while, but really have been enjoying keeping up with the WG from afar and building the Bham wiki database! Do you think it is worthwhile to create a [Category:Venues of the 2022 World Games] to have all of the venues in a single category? Also on an unrelated note, [Category:Regions Park] should be moved to [Category:Hoover Metropolitan Stadium]. Patriarca12 (talk) 11:58, 15 July 2022 (PDT)
    • It's a welcome surprise to see all this World Games content. I didn't plan on having the energy to do it myself, so thank you. I'm not sure about a venues category. Not necessarily opposed, but it seems like the "kind" of category that may just kind of stack up over time as a lot of these venues host a lot of notable events. Having them in the WG infobox seems like it does the trick. I'll take care of the other matter straight away. --Dystopos (talk) 12:03, 15 July 2022 (PDT)
      • Fair enough! I will not fiddle with a new category. Patriarca12 (talk) 09:39, 16 July 2022 (PDT)

Definition of Birmingham homicide

  • I added a 1983 homicide of a Birmingham man, Malcolm McRae, whose body was found in Shelby County, to the list of 1983 Birmingham homicides. Not sure if the criteria is that they "died in Birmingham" or were residents. Can revert if necessary. Thanks. Jazzi (talk) 10:56, 4 August 2022 (PDT)
    • I count "Birmingham homicides" as deaths caused by criminal acts that occur within the city limits. Sometimes that's not readily known, in which case I defer to whether Birmingham police are handling the investigation or not. In this case, I'd already counted his death among Shelby County's toll in List of homicides in 1983, so I've removed him from the Birmingham list. --Dystopos (talk) 11:00, 4 August 2022 (PDT)

BSC campaign

I guess I have to call them back and tell them that I won't, in fact, be able to cover their entire operating deficit. --Dystopos (talk) 08:31, 20 December 2022 (PST)